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Thanks Mike. We're now going to talk about UFOs. I've got Paul Norman with me. Paul Norman

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is the Vice President of the Victorian UFO Research Society. His visit I guess is provoked

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by the fact that it's the 10th anniversary of the disappearance of Cessna pilot Fred

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de Valentich who disappeared 10 years ago in his plane over Bass Strait. Always an amazing

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UFO case. You may recall that this guy was talking about being buzzed by UFOs just before

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he went off air and of course no trace has ever been found since. Well welcome to the

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program Paul. Thank you John. My pleasure. You've been looking at the phenomena of UFOs

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for 35 years now. Correct. It's funny that the UFO phenomena really does seem to start

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around the 1940s. Well it was started before that during World War II. They were called

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Foo Fighters. At that time the Allied Intelligence Officer thought they belonged to the Axis

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Powers and the Axis Powers thought they belonged to the Allies. After the war when they realized

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it belonged on either side then they started to set up investigation projects some of the

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governments but unfortunately these investigations have been carried on in secrecy with officials

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from speaking from both sides of the mouth. When they speak into the public they're treated

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as nonsense. When they speak into command they're treated as serious business. Well I'll

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tell you something very interesting. I've told the story on radio before so I'll tell

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it very quickly. I once got myself involved with UFO hoax and we perpetuated a hoax which

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was accepted by the media. This is about 20 years ago. Probably irresponsible of us

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but you know boys will be boys. And the next day the RAF put out a statement saying it was

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weather balloons which did make me think. You know I knew that it was a hoax and so why

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would the RAF put out a statement saying it was weather balloons. Well I'm not saying

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I believe in UFOs but I do. It's an indication that they were certainly sensitive to it and

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they came up with the story to explain our hoax. That's right. Well about 85 percent

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are mistaken identities only about five percent hoaxes but we have access to stress analysis

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equipment and we also have access to photo computer analysis high tech and the hoax

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cases are easy to break down. The main problem is mistaken identities of the 15 percent people

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and they think it's a UFO or a satellite or space junk but we sort those out at the telephone.

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Boys down about 15 percent about one out of five is worth a follow up and even some of

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them or a lot of them break down when you get to checking it out. When Jimmy Carter ran

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for the presidency I think that he made a promise to open the file that the US government had

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on UFOs. Is that correct? That's correct. Two or three of the presidents have made that

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statement but when they get to actually get to be president they a lot of things they can't

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able not allowed to talk about. Well it's extraordinary that somebody would back off make

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a promise and then not deliver on it. It might relate to this. There's been a rumor floating

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around the media for years and of course various UFO books etc about a UFO that's supposed to have

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crashed in the 1940s and that the US government holds the wreckage of the aircraft and their

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bodies in Nevada. That's correct. I know three of the scientists working on that case. I

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know about the story and they have documents on that and trying to get more and I think

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there will be a congressional investigation on that case. Now I know of the story. I've

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never seen it myself. Do you believe it? I'm on the borderline. I'm not sure about that. I deal

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with cases with tangible evidence that I know myself but I have open mind on this case. What

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about people who say they've met visitors? Well there again that's usually taken care of by

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psychologists who are doing hypnosis with people. That's again out of my field. Well it

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sort of relates I suppose to the case we had last year or two cases we've had recently in the

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Nullar Ball plane. The Null family had their car picked up and allegedly by some sort of

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UFO and then it was dropped 200 yards later and then most recently we had a case last

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week of somebody being housed in the same area around Euclid in South Australia I think.

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Well we interviewed the Null family when they got to Melbourne and they Nulls who had reached

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on top and fell something with the dust on her arm. The time they got to Melbourne our

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arm was swelling and they thought they were going 200 Ks to get out from under whatever

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it was but this car the driver insisted he was going 200 Ks full scale of the speedo.

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Well that car of course won't do 200 Ks on the ground they didn't realize it on the air

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till it was dropped. So a colleague John Ochtel and I went to Adelaide when they got the car

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there and we jacked up the front wheels just the front wheel drive and the wheels will

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spin that full scale that is documented by video channel 7.

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What about the residue material found on the car?

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I took the samples of that dust back to the United States and gave it to a retired NASA

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scientist who has contacts all over the world. He submitted it to the Phillips Laboratory

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for analysis and it was not brake dust like they had said it was. It was carbon, oxygen,

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silicon. The strangest thing is there is a possibility that it is astatine they are

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checking on these particles not only at that university or that laboratory but the other.

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Astatine is very scarce on the earth. It was first produced synthetically by three scientists

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at one of the universities in California. They bombarded bismuth with helium and they

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produced nucleic particles and they produced synthetic astatine. But it has a life of about

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seven or eight hours so once the reaction takes place and by the time the car got to

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it was at Seduna, yes Seduna where it was checked out for the first time for radiation

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but the police naturally there wasn't any indication of it. This was a strange part

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of the case.

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How often do you see depressions in the country? Depressions will be found in a field they

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will be scorching around it. Often there is calcification as they have been in intense

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temperature etc. How often do you come across phenomena like that?

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Well we have quite a few cases. I have pictures of some of them and there again we have submit

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these samples from the center of the edge and the control hundred feet away. It is checked

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out by what they call a thermolumination test and on some cases it has been found where

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they saw it had been heated with something higher than sunlight or something like that.

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One interesting case up near sale in 1980 was it rained and the water stood in the circle

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and black beads of mercury are all which indicated that the composition of the soil had changed.

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There are a lot of those circles found in Australia but most of the times no one has seen a UFO

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and we check them out if it seems to be interested but several cases where there is actually UFO

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has been seen sitting there. Where do you think they come from?

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I am not saying I don't know what to make of it frankly. Somebody suggested to me that UFOs

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are part of that we invent new myths. We always have to have myths and UFOs are part of the

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20th century process of creating our own 20th century mythology.

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I wouldn't know whether winter or why and I would have to have tangible evidence to make

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a statement but I do know that they operate on a technology far beyond their own. They

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have complete control over gravity. One of the main characteristics is they affect ignition

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systems, radio, TV when they are nearby, power blackouts. In fact, Fiddler Quillench, who was

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on his trip, he reported his engine coughing and rough idling when the thing was close to

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him. That is a natural characteristic of UFOs when they are close to these things.

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Do you think they may have abducted him or do you think he crashed into the sea?

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Well, after this sound that interrupted the transmission, he started to say Melbourne

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something. After that we don't know whether it went up or down or disintegrated. But the

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interesting thing is we compare his cases with, we got 19 others. We have a case of a helicopter

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pilot flying over Hove for a crew. They first saw that there was a tower, a beacon light

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on a tower. But the crew chief notified the pilot that they were approaching and he saw

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it was on a collision course and the Larry Cohen in his name from Cleveland, he put the

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helicopter in decline. This thing came, they were going 100 knots and this thing took up

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a position just ahead which meant it went along at their speed. This time it was a

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wonder how close it was to the ground. He looked down to his altimeter. He thought he was around

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1700 feet to his maismet. He was climbing to 3500 feet in a matter of minutes. There was

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a bump in a foot and he broke loose from whatever it was and went on to the tower. He

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went on to his destination. But the thing is he was describing the same sort of object that

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Valentich was describing. The green light, the maneuverability and the shape is a cigar

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shape, long shape, metallic appearance including a green light which Valentich was reporting

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moments before the radio transmission. Well, since the Knowles family came to the

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car, something on it, we actually know that it was in the air, the indications are.

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Well, there's another case that was very interesting which made a big burst of publicity. It involved

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a television journalist, Quentin Fogarty, who was flying I think over New Zealand somewhere

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and their plane got buzzed and they filmed it on the sort of film of these lights. Now, Quentin

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Fogarty I know is not a crank. He's a very straight hard working journalist who I suppose is in

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some way severely embarrassed by the experience he had because he probably damaged his credibility

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to even say that it had happened and yet I know he would never have made it up. I know he's a very

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credible man. Well, a scientist did computer analysis on those frames. There were about

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3,000 frames and it was an unknown. The problem in this field, there are too many people talking

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about it who don't know anything about it. You had about 18 different explanations of the Quentin

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Fogarty case coming from all over the world, all contradicting and unsatisfactory. Coming from

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armchair experts who had never investigated, but Dr. Bruce McAvay, he's a photo physicist in the

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United States. He was a chief investigator of that case and there were 20 scientists on the

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investigation, 3,000 frames and it's a genuine case.

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And no one really came up with any explanation of it, it was an unidentified flying object.

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Unidentified UFO, unidentified.

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Well, are they... I mean you must have a few. I know you take the engineer, I know you're an engineer.

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In fact, the Herald reports you as running a fire station in Tennessee when you first saw a UFO

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back in 1946 or whenever. Of course, you're not a... you're an engineer running a Tennessee power

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station. But such a... we always make mistakes like that and I make plenty of myself so I'm not attacking

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the Herald. But clearly you have that sort of engineers approach to it. There's no room for

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romance. You're only interested in facts. But you must have some opinions. Now, do you think...

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do you think they're from outer space or do you think that perhaps they're from here?

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Well, I know... I don't know whether Winston Whye, as I mentioned, but there's no scientists on

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Earth. Well, the scientists today, the vast majority, will say the maneuvers and operations they're doing

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it's against the laws of physics which is identical to the statement they were making back in the turn

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of the century when they were saying that the airplane was impossible because it's against the laws

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of physics. Two weeks after the first flight of 150 feet, the leading scientific journal of the day

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was still giving reasons it couldn't be done. Science is not always reality. I...

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Well, science deals with the mind.

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I'm inclined to think there from elsewhere because there are no scientists on Earth that I know about

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to... you know, they'll brush it off. We do have a small percentage happening in the south on the analysis

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like this dust and other...

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There are a little bit of physical evidence.

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Yes.

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Is there a changing... are the nature of sightings and experiences with UFOs changing or are they basically the same as they were

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back in the 1940s?

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The characteristics like the physical effects they have on people, the electromagnetic effects, the cattle stock in a panic.

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There is more attention paid to these cases where hypnosis is being used. People who claim that they have been abducted

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and there's more hypnosis going on to try to determine.

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Well, I was glad to talk to you today because I had in last week with this treaver who's written an author...

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a book as an author and he's actually been quite a... you know, his publishing career has been very successful

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He's respected all through the United States and he's sort of, I guess, damaged his own credibility by writing a book called Communion

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which is about his experiences, alleged experiences with aliens or whatever. He doesn't know whether they're aliens,

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whether he's imagined it or whether they're from some sort of hidden spiritual civilization that exists on Earth.

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It's pretty way out sort of stuff but nevertheless he strikes me as being a very credible man and a man who's

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would much rather have not had the experience. But that's the other sort of the UFO experience

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and we are hearing a bit about that sort of thing. And I wonder what you make of that. How much... have you talked to people?

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Yes, I have. I've never put them under hypnosis. I'm not in that field but I've talked to the ones out in hypnotizing.

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We are paying more attention to these cases like taking, as example, the helicopter case. Was that attempted abduction?

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Was the Noel's family case attempted abduction? And that is the 14th case we know about where the cars have been lifted.

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Of course there might be others that we've never heard of. And it leads us to wonder was the Valentich a successful one.

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But as I mentioned, I must go with tangible evidence. After this sound we don't know whether it went up or down or disintegrated.

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Well, you have seen one yourself. Apart from the experience you had 35 years ago when you saw a disshaped object which was moving around a bit like a helicopter,

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and then took off at a great speed, which is again, it seems to me, a classic pattern. Have you seen anything since?

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Yes, I saw two but that's what got me interested that first when I started paying attention to reports.

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After that, I saw two more after that but it was up in northern Victoria around Leechville.

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When they were having a period of activity up there, a man, his brother, was reporting UFO sightings.

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I set out myself 15 nights and I did say two but they were at a distance and there was a radical movement.

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It was doing figure eights, circles and all this. That's all I could say about it.

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But these night lights are very difficult. There's not much detail you can get.

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For example, we have a lot of pictures of globs of light. You photograph an airplane at a distance.

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You only get a glob of light with the airplane. That doesn't mean there's nobody there because there will be 400 people.

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The same thing, the difference in the UFO is these erratic movements they have. Do all sorts of stunts.

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They say they're mischievous stunts.

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The best daytime reports come from airline pilots and almost invariably daytime they are dull silver aluminum color.

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We think they have a glow about them like a wrist watch. It doesn't show up until it's dark. However, that's a theory.

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I met an airline pilot who was going from Sydney to Melbourne who was following another plane of a different hour.

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One was ANSET, one was TAA. He heard the TAA or ANSET people talking on radio about a UFO.

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He didn't actually see it but he heard the pilots and the plane which were a couple of hours away.

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No doubt to help the market out.

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Suits the customer to fly at the same time.

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The one in front had this experience and he heard them talking about it on the radio but nothing ever came.

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It's sort of interesting.

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I've got a caller here, Bob, on the line who's got a comment about the Valentin case.

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Hello, Bob.

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Hello, John.

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A couple of years ago we were down the southern coast of Victoria down at Trecklip Trap which is pretty close to Wilsham's country there.

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We found some strips of aluminum that tangled up into the rocks.

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They looked like the leading edges of a plane that were curved with rivets three or four feet long.

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They were about three or four pieces of them.

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A couple of them had plywood-pop riveted to them.

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The one piece that looked like the leading edge of a wing, up one end of it, it was completely melted and twisted.

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It had reminded us of something that had really been hot and burnt one end of it.

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The other end was OK.

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I often thought that it could have been something to do with that Valentin case but I didn't pick them up and carry them.

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I didn't carry them back with us because I was so far from the car.

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Ported?

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Sorry?

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Did you report it?

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I didn't report it.

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No, because it's one of those sort of things you think you go back and say something.

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How do you report it to the police?

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You never hear any more about it.

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I often thought about it and when your show was on just then it reminded me again.

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Well, it's a bit of a mystery, isn't it?

202
00:20:48,240 --> 00:20:52,240
Yes, I wondered how it could be melt so much this aluminium.

203
00:20:52,240 --> 00:21:00,240
It was really hot just as if it's been in a furnace but the other end was completely nice and curved and clean.

204
00:21:00,240 --> 00:21:03,240
Well, aluminium, you've got to comment on that, Bob.

205
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I'm sorry, Uncle.

206
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We're in direct contact with the leading scientists who are taking interest in this subject.

207
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Anything like that is found. If you'll send it to this post office box, we're sure you will put it in the top scientists in their hands.

208
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They have access to all sorts of laboratories.

209
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I'll poke the name out.

210
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Paul Norman.

211
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It's the International, it's the World of Youth.

212
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Hang on.

213
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The Victorian UFO Research Society.

214
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Post Office Box, Marabin, Victoria 3189.

215
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Post Office Box, Marabin, Victoria 3189.

216
00:21:43,240 --> 00:21:47,240
And Paul Norman is the man to write to if you haven't experienced.

217
00:21:47,240 --> 00:21:52,240
Always interested in hearing from people who've come into contact with UFOs.

218
00:21:52,240 --> 00:21:56,240
We will keep their name confidential if they so desire.

219
00:21:56,240 --> 00:21:59,240
Okay, Paul. Well, thank you very much for coming today.

220
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It's one of life's mysteries.

221
00:22:01,240 --> 00:22:05,240
You can talk around in circles and you'll never get anywhere.

222
00:22:05,240 --> 00:22:10,240
I don't know what to make of it myself, but I guess there's something there.

223
00:22:10,240 --> 00:22:12,240
Lots of people believe in it now anyway.

224
00:22:12,240 --> 00:22:14,240
Thank you, Josh. My pleasure.

225
00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:16,240
Thank you very much, Paul Norman.

226
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He's the Vice President of the Victorian UFO Research Society in today and the, I guess, remembering Fred Blentage, the pilot who disappeared with his Cessna over Bass Strait after seeing he was being buzzed by a UFO and it's 10 years ago, almost to the day.

227
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8 minutes to 11, currently 15 degrees.

228
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We're celebrating, I don't think that's quite the right term actually, we're acknowledging this month, in fact tomorrow, the 10th anniversary of the disappearance of Fred Blentage, the disappearance of he and his Cessna over Bass Strait.

229
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The disappearance, as we all know, I think has become one of the great post-war mysteries, what actually happened.

230
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There's a solid body of thought, including his family, which is quite convinced that a UFO, an unidentified flying object, was involved in Blentage's disappearance in some way.

231
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And as I say, it's 10 years tomorrow since it all happened.

232
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So in the studio tonight, I have with me a 70-year-old man by the name of Paul Norman.

233
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He will be familiar to those of you who are interested in UFOs.

234
00:23:16,240 --> 00:23:21,240
He's made it really his life mission, researching UFO cases around the world.

235
00:23:21,240 --> 00:23:32,240
He is obviously a believer in UFOs, and although he does admit that there have been a lot of frauds, he's vice president of the UFO Research Society here in Victoria.

236
00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:34,240
Paul Norman, good evening and thanks for coming in.

237
00:23:34,240 --> 00:23:35,240
My pleasure.

238
00:23:35,240 --> 00:23:40,240
Now let's start with the Belentic case because it's 10 years tomorrow.

239
00:23:40,240 --> 00:23:44,240
Just let's recap, what do you say happened?

240
00:23:44,240 --> 00:24:06,240
Well, he was on his way to King Island to get crayfish, and soon after he left the lighthouse vicinity at the Cape Otway, he thought he saw an airplane in the area, and he inquired to the traffic controller who informed them that there was no traffic in the area.

241
00:24:06,240 --> 00:24:10,240
But as the object came closer, he saw that it wasn't.

242
00:24:10,240 --> 00:24:21,240
He saw that it was long shape, metallic appearance, and it had a maneuverability that he couldn't estimate the speed.

243
00:24:21,240 --> 00:24:36,240
And he reported his engine coughing, or idling, like this electromagnetic effect, which is a characteristic of UFOs throughout the world when they close the ignition system, radio, TV.

244
00:24:36,240 --> 00:24:42,240
And one of his last statements was this strange object was hovering over him and it was not an aircraft.

245
00:24:42,240 --> 00:24:50,240
And there was a mystery sound that interrupted the transmission, and after that we don't know what happened.

246
00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:55,240
We started to say Melbourne something and then this sound, it's never been explained.

247
00:24:55,240 --> 00:25:05,240
Now this conversation of course with control was taped. Do you believe we've heard all the tape?

248
00:25:05,240 --> 00:25:16,240
I think we have the Department of Transport who never did release a sound portion of the tape although they gave the transfer.

249
00:25:16,240 --> 00:25:27,240
And the father listened to the tape to identify his son's voice whether it was, and he seems to think that it was all there.

250
00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:38,240
Now you're not just convinced that it was a UFO in his case because of what was said, because you believe that there have been other cases, don't you?

251
00:25:38,240 --> 00:25:40,240
Similar, very similar to this.

252
00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:58,240
That's correct. We compare this with other cases. We have a case of a helicopter pilot over Ohio who was describing the same sort of an object that Flentige was describing.

253
00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:05,240
Manoeuvrability, long shape with a green light that Fiddlerquist was describing.

254
00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:12,240
Well Mr. Norman, you've brought in a tape of some of the conversation. Now this is between the helicopter pilot and who?

255
00:26:12,240 --> 00:26:20,240
This was the helicopter pilot telling about his experience. Not just not about him, his experiences.

256
00:26:20,240 --> 00:26:27,240
He's been talking about what he saw. Let's have him do a couple of minutes of it and then we'll comment on it afterwards.

257
00:26:27,240 --> 00:26:39,240
A trained military personnel with thousands of hours of flying time behind. What occurred next might seem like science fiction, but it happened.

258
00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:43,240
My last look at my altimeter, we were 1700 feet.

259
00:26:44,240 --> 00:26:50,240
Then this craft began to move slowly to the west, away from us.

260
00:26:50,240 --> 00:27:04,240
At this time I was worried we were going to hit the ground, but I looked at my altimeter and our helicopter was 3500 feet, climbing 1000 feet a minute with no changes in the control.

261
00:27:04,240 --> 00:27:10,240
We went from 1700 feet to 3500 feet in a matter of seconds and never knew it.

262
00:27:10,240 --> 00:27:16,240
The helicopter topped out at 3800 feet and was a bump, but turbulent.

263
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:22,240
At which time we had control of the aircraft. Again, I had control and we took it back down to 2500 feet.

264
00:27:22,240 --> 00:27:30,240
Then we continued on the cleaver. As far as the vehicle itself, there's no doubt in our mind what it looked like.

265
00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:37,240
The craft that could move with terrific speeds in excess of 1000 knots and then stop on a dime.

266
00:27:37,240 --> 00:27:45,240
It maintains altitude, can change altitude, climbs, descends to encounter a UFO.

267
00:27:45,240 --> 00:27:51,240
When it does approach the aircraft you have no idea what it is, or I think your civilized the polite with us.

268
00:27:51,240 --> 00:27:55,240
But you can't get away from it. You don't have that much time to respire.

269
00:27:55,240 --> 00:28:01,240
Alright, now that's some of the description there by the Ohio helicopter pilot who obviously survived the experience.

270
00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:06,240
A four man crew. They got back to tell about their experience and Frederick Valentins did not.

271
00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:12,240
Right, but what is the similarities there between that tape and Valentin?

272
00:28:12,240 --> 00:28:20,240
Well, I have wondered, especially since some of these other cases, like an old car being picked up and all that,

273
00:28:20,240 --> 00:28:25,240
this sound, the sound, latching on to the aircraft.

274
00:28:25,240 --> 00:28:35,240
And his description with 19 other descriptions, they all seem to harmonize with each other.

275
00:28:35,240 --> 00:28:39,240
Because you say there are about 20 such cases similar to Frederick Valentins?

276
00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:45,240
Yes, some of them we know they have crashed. And others that just disappeared.

277
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We don't know whether one up or down are disintegrated. We know in one case it actually disintegrated the plane when a UFO was nearby.

278
00:28:55,240 --> 00:28:58,240
In fact it had fired on the UFO.

279
00:28:58,240 --> 00:29:05,240
Alright, now the obvious question to this, and the general sort of question I suppose arising out of all these cases.

280
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I mean why do these UFOs only seem to come in sort of isolated cases where someone like Fred Valentins is seemingly on his own away from other people?

281
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I mean why doesn't a UFO land in the city square here in Melbourne? So here we are.

282
00:29:21,240 --> 00:29:27,240
Well, I'd have to know what the motive is for. I could answer that. I don't know the whether, when and why.

283
00:29:27,240 --> 00:29:32,240
But hundreds of people see them at the time around the cities in those areas.

284
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But these strange cases are taking place in isolated areas where they come down on the ground and do these things. We don't know why that is.

285
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Because that's what creates the problem where people say well I don't believe Paul Norman. I don't believe what Frederick Valentins said.

286
00:29:55,240 --> 00:30:02,240
I mean why can't we just say well not Frederick Valentins, unfortunately, crashed his plane at best rate?

287
00:30:02,240 --> 00:30:08,240
Well, there wasn't anything floating in what he would describe in what the other people had said.

288
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There's some theory, one of the theories is that they gradually reveal in their presence.

289
00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:18,240
So we won't have a culture shock at speculation, I don't know.

290
00:30:18,240 --> 00:30:27,240
But we do know that they don't like to be public. These strange cases are taking place in isolated areas.

291
00:30:27,240 --> 00:30:29,240
The UFOs don't like to be too public.

292
00:30:29,240 --> 00:30:35,240
Well, obviously they're not. What their motive would be I wouldn't know.

293
00:30:35,240 --> 00:30:38,240
Now, you have seen a UFO?

294
00:30:38,240 --> 00:30:46,240
Yes, that's what got me interested back in 1953. I saw an object. I was superintendent of a power station.

295
00:30:46,240 --> 00:30:47,240
What about your assistant?

296
00:30:47,240 --> 00:30:48,240
This was in Tennessee.

297
00:30:48,240 --> 00:30:49,240
Right.

298
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And I was called outside to see what it was. I thought it was a nice fine helicopter approaching coming up the river below the power station about the speed of a helicopter.

299
00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:11,240
And when it got over the station it stopped for about a half minute and then it sped away as fast, at least as fast as a jet with no sound.

300
00:31:11,240 --> 00:31:14,240
How big was it about the size of a helicopter?

301
00:31:15,240 --> 00:31:16,240
Well, bigger than that.

302
00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:24,240
I'd say it was a circular object. It's just to estimate, I would say, it was about 30 feet in diameter.

303
00:31:24,240 --> 00:31:25,240
Does it have lots?

304
00:31:25,240 --> 00:31:34,240
Yes, a whitish-blue light blinking on or off, pulsating about once a second, change dim bright, dim bright.

305
00:31:34,240 --> 00:31:36,240
And we're scared when this happened.

306
00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:41,240
I was awestruck. I was right.

307
00:31:41,240 --> 00:31:43,240
And we're scared when this happened?

308
00:31:43,240 --> 00:31:49,240
I was awestruck. I was astonished. No, I wasn't scared.

309
00:31:49,240 --> 00:31:55,240
In fact, I thought that, well, perhaps the wind is blowing the sound away from me.

310
00:31:55,240 --> 00:32:00,240
And when I saw it, no one ran to Tennessee. That's wintertime, of course.

311
00:32:00,240 --> 00:32:08,240
I went out and got to tip in the blades of grass, dry grass, flipped it up, and what a little breeze it was was blowing my way.

312
00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:10,240
And yet there was no sound?

313
00:32:10,240 --> 00:32:21,240
I didn't hear no sound, but people that have been near them, they report a sound similar to a humming transformer and some swishing sound sometime.

314
00:32:21,240 --> 00:32:24,240
But they have to be very close to these objects.

315
00:32:24,240 --> 00:32:29,240
No, so when all this happened to you, did you say to yourself, oh, look, Paul, don't be stupid.

316
00:32:29,240 --> 00:32:35,240
There's some physical explanation of this, some sort of funny lighting or...

317
00:32:35,240 --> 00:32:46,240
Yes, I tried to think of all this, but then I started, naturally I started paying attention to the reports, started interviewing people.

318
00:32:46,240 --> 00:32:52,240
The best reports come from our line pilots, daytime sightings, that is.

319
00:32:52,240 --> 00:32:59,240
And invariably in the daytime they're dull silver or aluminum color.

320
00:32:59,240 --> 00:33:04,240
We think they possibly have something like a wristwatch.

321
00:33:04,240 --> 00:33:10,240
Now, on your wristwatch, it doesn't track the attention until after dark, you don't see this light.

322
00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:13,240
However, that is only a theory.

323
00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:22,240
So, so the... once this happened to you and then you notice other reports and you felt God, there's similarities between what I saw and heard.

324
00:33:22,240 --> 00:33:28,240
Now, did you actually report your specific sightings? Did you try and report your case to anybody?

325
00:33:28,240 --> 00:33:35,240
I told the people I worked with, I was telling them about, there were several reports along about that time.

326
00:33:35,240 --> 00:33:47,240
And that same month there was a pilot, two airmen disappeared while they were investigating a UFO case.

327
00:33:47,240 --> 00:33:52,240
It happened to Kenros, near Kenros Air Force Base in Michigan.

328
00:33:52,240 --> 00:33:59,240
The object was first detected by radar and they had one interceptor on the base and they scrambled it.

329
00:33:59,240 --> 00:34:12,240
They reported this object and as they got closer to it, first there was a lot of static on the radio and then it faded all together.

330
00:34:12,240 --> 00:34:19,240
But the radar, they had the blip of the UFO on the radar and the blip of the interceptor approaching.

331
00:34:19,240 --> 00:34:35,240
And when they merged, the two blip merged for about 20 seconds and then they took off a search area like the Lackville and it's about three weeks and nothing was ever found.

332
00:34:35,240 --> 00:34:44,240
Well, a little did I dream back in November, 1953 that I'd been involved in the greatest mystery in the Australian aviation history.

333
00:34:44,240 --> 00:34:51,240
And of course, since that time, 1953, you spent most of your years travelling around the world looking at it.

334
00:34:51,240 --> 00:34:58,240
No, no, I was in the power stations until 1976, doing this part-time.

335
00:34:58,240 --> 00:35:04,240
But after that, I opted for early retirement to do it this full-time.

336
00:35:04,240 --> 00:35:05,240
It's become an obsession?

337
00:35:05,240 --> 00:35:12,240
Well, some people say, some people say compulsion, some obsession, being on whether my friend or folk.

338
00:35:12,240 --> 00:35:18,240
I mean, I'm sure you've been called, you know, a nut and a crank by many people. How do you react to that?

339
00:35:18,240 --> 00:35:24,240
Well, that doesn't bother me. These police usually come from people who don't know what's going on.

340
00:35:24,240 --> 00:35:34,240
The real little green men are humans who are so green in fact, they don't realize something's going on that they don't understand.

341
00:35:34,240 --> 00:35:43,240
They are the real little green men. As far as green men from outer space, I've been investigating now for 35 years.

342
00:35:43,240 --> 00:35:52,240
And I know investigators, personally, quandary investigators all over the world, and I never heard of one case of a little green man.

343
00:35:52,240 --> 00:36:00,240
The only little green men I know are humans, so green they don't realize something is going on that they don't understand.

344
00:36:00,240 --> 00:36:13,240
Alright, now can we move our attention to the situation, I think it was out in the Nullibor, the family that came from Perth and were coming to Melbourne by car this year.

345
00:36:13,240 --> 00:36:17,240
I think you went out there to have a look at their car, didn't you?

346
00:36:17,240 --> 00:36:23,240
Yes, when it got dad-led, we went out and we interviewed the family.

347
00:36:23,240 --> 00:36:25,240
The Knowles family, wasn't it?

348
00:36:25,240 --> 00:36:32,240
The Knowles family, when they got to Melbourne, and Fay Knowles, who had reached on top with their arm covered.

349
00:36:32,240 --> 00:36:33,240
Yes, that's right.

350
00:36:33,240 --> 00:36:40,240
At times, she got to Melbourne, her arm was swelling, and I suspected it was some sort of temporary radiation.

351
00:36:41,240 --> 00:36:51,240
But a colleague and I, John Auquitel, we went out to examine the car when it got to Adelaide, and the driver.

352
00:36:51,240 --> 00:36:57,240
He thought he was doing 200 k's to get far from under the object.

353
00:36:57,240 --> 00:37:05,240
He didn't realize he was in the air until it dropped back, and he reported 200 k's, it's a speedo full scale.

354
00:37:05,240 --> 00:37:14,240
Of course, that car won't go 200 k's on the ground, but what we did was check up the front wheels when we got out there.

355
00:37:14,240 --> 00:37:23,240
It's a front wheel drive, and those wheels will spin at 200 k's full scale, which tied in precisely what he said.

356
00:37:23,240 --> 00:37:24,240
You believed that, then?

357
00:37:24,240 --> 00:37:29,240
That was, uh, uh, documented by Channel 7.

358
00:37:29,240 --> 00:37:31,240
Now, you believed that family, you believed it was a U.S. by the way?

359
00:37:31,240 --> 00:37:48,240
It all ties in, and I took the dust samples, and we back him out of the car, back to the States with him, and a retired scientist from NASA had submitted it to the Philippus Laboratory, a high technology laboratory.

360
00:37:48,240 --> 00:37:50,240
And it was not brake dust.

361
00:37:50,240 --> 00:37:52,240
What was it?

362
00:37:52,240 --> 00:38:04,240
Well, among other things, oxygen, silicon, but the most interesting part was the indication that it could have been astatine.

363
00:38:04,240 --> 00:38:12,240
Now, astatine has a half-life when it's first split up atomic elements.

364
00:38:12,240 --> 00:38:25,240
For example, it was first synthetically produced in California University, but bombarding bissbots with helium, nuclei.

365
00:38:25,240 --> 00:38:33,240
And when that action takes place, it's slightly radioactive, but it has a half-life of seven or eight hours.

366
00:38:33,240 --> 00:38:41,240
And by the time they had got to, to Seduna, and where it was checked for the pulleys for radiation, naturally it would indicate.

367
00:38:41,240 --> 00:38:57,240
But I've recently found that after I went back there, I found another gentleman who went to that area about an hour after it happened, and picked up a sort of fiber stuff on his about a quarter of a mile that spread along the highway.

368
00:38:57,240 --> 00:39:13,240
And between his fingers, it crumbled in something that resembled, well, some sort of graphite, but it was so light the wind was blowing it away.

369
00:39:13,240 --> 00:39:25,240
And one week later, one week later, it was imported, he broke out the same symptoms as Fay knows only he was admitted to the hospital a few days later.

370
00:39:25,240 --> 00:39:33,240
And we're trying to now to get the two doctors together with his permission to see, to try to determine if this is what happened.

371
00:39:33,240 --> 00:39:46,240
Well, it's a strange case. So is Fridtich Volentich. Well, the whole thing is just fascinating. I just wish we just knew a little bit more, but that's what you've dedicated the rest of your life to, to finding out more about UFOs.

372
00:39:46,240 --> 00:39:58,240
Now, you're interested in people getting in touch with you, want to either talk to you about various things that they might have seen, ask you whether in fact they may have seen UFOs, or in fact, join your society.

373
00:39:58,240 --> 00:40:03,240
So your box number is if people want to contact you, P.O. Box Morabin.

374
00:40:03,240 --> 00:40:06,240
We will keep their names confidential if they're so, so.

375
00:40:06,240 --> 00:40:14,240
All right, so if they've got any queries about it or if they want to belong to the society, or if they've had an experience which they feel you should know something about.

376
00:40:14,240 --> 00:40:20,240
Well, how are you, well, tomorrow is not really celebration day, is it? How will you spend tomorrow?

377
00:40:20,240 --> 00:40:31,240
On the telephone talking to other people, and we've got calls coming in pretty often now where I am about the case, asking questions about it.

378
00:40:31,240 --> 00:40:37,240
Ten years tomorrow since Frederick Van Elitick disappeared. All right, Paul Norman, thank you very much indeed for coming in tonight.

379
00:40:37,240 --> 00:40:39,240
My pleasure, thank you.